The Filipino Bubble

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Article 75 gets most of them;

Art. 74. The property relationship between husband and wife shall be governed in the following order:

(1) By marriage settlements executed before the marriage;

(2) By the provisions of this Code; and

(3) By the local custom. (118)

Art. 75. The future spouses may, in the marriage settlements, agree upon the regime of absolute community, conjugal partnership of gains, complete separation of property, or any other regime. In the absence of a marriage settlement, or when the regime agreed upon is void, the system of absolute community of property as established in this Code shall govern.





So unless you have complete separation of property written into your marriage settlements, or the property is specified as strictly hers in the marriage settlements, the property is as much yours as it is hers. You cannot lease from yourself, therefore you cannot lease from your wife, because it is part of the community property.

For those that do have the foresight to have separation of property in their marriage contract, article 84 may play a part;

Art. 84. If the future spouses agree upon a regime other than the absolute community of property, they cannot donate to each other in their marriage settlements more than one-fifth of their present property. Any excess shall be considered void.






Chapter 3 specifies what is and is not community property. Basically, unless this property was given to your wife prior to the marriage or through inheritance, it is community property.

Article 116 applies also;

Art. 116. All property acquired during the marriage, whether the acquisition appears to have been made, contracted or registered in the name of one or both spouses, is presumed to be conjugal unless the contrary is proved.






And now read carefully;

Art. 149. The family, being the foundation of the nation, is a basic social institution which public policy cherishes and protects. Consequently, family relations are governed by law and no custom, practice or agreement destructive of the family shall be recognized or given effect. (216a, 218a)

Art. 50. Family relations include those:

(1) Between husband and wife;

(2) Between parents and children;

(3) Among brothers and sisters, whether of the full or half-blood. (217a)




For you to have rights of conjugal property over and above your wife WILL be considered destructive to the family unit.

So in a sense, yes you can have a contract with your wife, many lawyers will be happy to take your P200 to draw one up, but it will be declared void as soon as it hits the first (or second) judge. There is considerable case law which shows this. I will be out of town for the rest of the week or I would find for you case law that shows clearly how the courts look upon having ANY kind of contract with your wife. The marriage contract reigns supreme in the family code, and all other contracts made after the marriage are void. Although there is no straightforward single sentence in the family code that states you cannot lease from her, it is all there throughout the entire executive order.

However, it is not uncommon practice amongst alien/Filipino marriages, and the reason there are not a lot more problems arising from it is, THE WIFE DOESN'T KNOW!

Don't worry, I won't tell her.



Larry.

[babel-fish]

So unless you have complete separation of property written into your marriage settlements, or the property is specified as strictly hers in the marriage settlements, the property is as much yours as it is hers. You cannot lease from yourself, therefore you cannot lease from your wife, because it is part of the community property.

Even thought the property under this law is shared you can still lease anything from your wife, leasing is not mentioned through out this document. Leasing does not mean the property or Item belongs to you. It does not mess up the marriage contract one Iota. It however restrict the wife from chucking you off the property you both own.

I can see your argument but this needs to be sorted out in the court of law to create a presidence. At present there are many ex-pats using leasing to give them some protection, I personaly know many.

I personal think its best not to marry if you are buying property here under a love ones name. I am waiting for this new move that will allow us aliens to buy a set amount of land in our own name. Its taking ages to go through government.

But of course your settlement prior to marriage may have a problem if that means what bought after the happy event, there again that sort of thing may need presidence in the court of law.

Thankfully my own plan is not to buy a house or property for myself, my partner is a landowner and I might build house as a present to protect her stability if i die this of couse includes other plans. I am a rover and want to move when I get fed up even to a different country with in asia if i so wish. At present I am happy in Sibulan near dear old duma.

Thanks for your legal explaination and sorry we differ in the reading of a Phillippine law, but at least both of us have read it and I expect like me other just important ones. Its best to be street wise

best wishes from the fish and thats with full respect.

PS. I was the criminal and sort of bright spark that came up with the leasing thing 7 years ago, hope I was not wrong as a lot of people will be very annoyed at me, lol

But maybe some other bright sparks came up with the same idea I will never know.

[shadow]

As I said, there is legal precedence for this, and has been upheld this way in the supreme court. You cannot lease from yourself, so you cannot lease conjugal property from your wife.

I too know many people doing this, and they get away with it because it is not well known, even among attorneys, that it will not be worth the paper it is printed on if it ever does wind up in court. (Unless of course, the judge is somehow influenced)



If I get time, after I get back this weekend I'll post some of the court rulings on this. They are there.

Larry.

[babel-fish]

Like to see that thanks you sound like your a filipino and into the law game, that can be useful here. But with the name of Larry maybe not.

[shadow]

Originally Posted by babel-fish

Like to see that thanks you sound like your a filipino and into the law game, that can be useful here. But with the name of Larry maybe not.

Well you're half right. I'm American.

Thought for the day;

If you lease conjugal property from your wife, the money you pay with may or may not be conjugal property, BUT, the money recieved IS conjugal property, would it not seem that nothing has transpired? There was no transaction?

In fact, absolutely nothing has transpired. If I had a dollar, and I gave it to myself, what actually transpired?

Absolutely nothing!

Larry.

[babel-fish]

If the land is both names I agree, but being a alien its not its only in one name, do you own it no your wife does. Only when she dies you can own it, the law is funny here especial with aliens as I said a presidencies needs to be set, you said there was and I am waiting to see it.

I am always interested in something I don’t know about the law here or the changes. At present I have not seen a case in reference to the problem at hand however it seems you have, I am very interested as I am in my own laws in UK and America its a sort of hobby and many expats ask my advice on such things regularly else where on the web. However I never declare myself at being a legal expert. Though in UK many use to look at me that way, concerning business law and accountancy. I am all ways seeking the truth and love analyzing problems it’s my life.

You have now left me in anticipation in waiting for the presidencies to prove your point nothing else will change the expectation. It’s obvious you have connections to the supreme court that I don’t have as I can not find nothing that suggests I am wrong

Philippines supreme court

Larry these rulings your going to give me must be on this leasing and foreigner issue alone, its very important to be specific. I know there is loads concerning other matters of ownership but please lets point to leasing of land by foriegners from their wife.

This is very important to expats that have done this already as we know there are so many of them and I feel very guilty for giving this advice to many of my friends over the past 7 years.

[shadow]

Sorry, I have not had time to donate to this issue. Some of us have to work for our pesos. However, I did stumble across something in the civil code that may be of interest. From the civil code;

Art. 1490. The husband and the wife cannot sell property to each other, except:

(1) When a separation of property was agreed upon in the marriage settlements; or

(2) When there has been a judicial separation or property under Article 191. (1458a)


Art. 1646. The persons disqualified to buy referred to in Articles 1490 and 1491, are also disqualified to become lessees of the things mentioned therein. (n)

Is that plain enough? You cannot lease from your wife, period! (Unless you have separation of property in your marriage contract)

Larry.

Originally Posted by babel-fish

If the land is both names I agree, but being a alien its not its only in one name, do you own it no your wife does. Only when she dies you can own it, the law is funny here especial with aliens as I said a presidencies needs to be set, you said there was and I am waiting to see it.

I am always interested in something I don’t know about the law here or the changes. At present I have not seen a case in reference to the problem at hand however it seems you have, I am very interested as I am in my own laws in UK and America its a sort of hobby and many expats ask my advice on such things regularly else where on the web. However I never declare myself at being a legal expert. Though in UK many use to look at me that way, concerning business law and accountancy. I am all ways seeking the truth and love analyzing problems it’s my life.

You have now left me in anticipation in waiting for the presidencies to prove your point nothing else will change the expectation. It’s obvious you have connections to the supreme court that I don’t have as I can not find nothing that suggests I am wrong

Philippines supreme court

Larry these rulings your going to give me must be on this leasing and foreigner issue alone, its very important to be specific. I know there is loads concerning other matters of ownership but please lets point to leasing of land by foriegners from their wife.

This is very important to expats that have done this already as we know there are so many of them and I feel very guilty for giving this advice to many of my friends over the past 7 years.